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I've been blogging about the Boston Bruins for about 8 months now and I never fully realized how passionate Boston Bruins bloggers are. People who know me know that I believe in building relationships and the same goes with my readers and other bloggers out there. To continue building those relationships, I asked Chris Crawford from Hub Hockey, Cornelius Hardenbergh from The Hockey Blog Adventure and Sarah Connors from Tea Party Throwdown to join me for a Bruins Round Table discussion where we will talk about some issues regarding the Bruins.
Last night the four of us got together and spoke about a goalie controversy, Lucic on the IR, calling out Claude Julien and many different things. This is part I of that discussion.
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Greg Ezell: We all know each other, but we should probably introduce ourselves for the sake of professionalism. I'm Greg Ezell from Something's Bruin.
Cornelius Hardenbergh: I'm Cornelius Hardenbergh, of the Hockey Blog Adventure
Chris Crawford: I'm Chris Crawford from Hub Hockey... Hey guys and lady...
I'm Sarah Connors from Tea Party Throwdown (no terminator jokes please)!
So the first topic we're going to talk about tonight is the goalie situation. Tim Thomas is last year's Vezina Trophy winner but has been under performing by most people's standards. On the other hand, Tuukka Rask has lived up or exceeded most expectations. Do you hand the starting job to Tuukka, keep it with Thomas or split the time? We'll start with Cornelius.
Split the time. The simple fact is that among goalies that have had a reasonable amount of starts (>8 for these purposes) Thomas is still in the top 20 for save percent and GAA. I shouldn't have to remind you that this is a 30 team league and we're doing quite well with 2 good goalies. That said, Tuukk Nuukkem is in the top 3 for those same stats and we should be riding the hot goalie. Thomas always seems to like overcoming adversity; let’s give him some of that.
I think Claude worries about him getting rusty, but unless Thomas broke his back or is otherwise injured like Manny last year than Tuukka should be getting more playing time if he's playing better
Chris, your thoughts.
I think the Bruins should go in the direction of last years team and basically switch back and forth for awhile. If one goalie starts to streak then you stick with him until he stumbles. It worked well for them. As of right now you need to consider for the sake of naming your "starter" as Tuukka Rask. But the whole Thomas struggling still bothers me. He has had a few bad games but you can't just write off a Vezina winner that quickly. Plus when looking at the goal production in front of him, it’s nothing to write home about. Tuukka is getting an average of 3-goals per game in front of him while Thomas is getting only 2. May not seem all that bad but keep in mind Thomas (7-8-4) has lost 7-games this season by a one-goal margin.
Sarah, your take?
I think the two of them need to continue splitting their starts. Looking around the league, two places come to mind where there are similar situations - a veteran goaltender being either outplayed or matched by a rookie (Chicago with Niemi/Huet and Washington with Varlamov/Theodore) and it creates a nice rivalry for both the veteran and the rookie involved. On the other hand, several Bruins have stated outright that they feel secure with Tuukka in net - I'm wondering if they feel the same about Timmy. Games when Thomas is in net always feel a lot more frantic to me. I think right now, Tuukka's got a nice comfortable rhythm going; until that changes, I think he should get half or a little more than half the starts, give Thomas something to work against. If Tuukka starts to falter, switch it up - more starts for Thomas. Having two goalies who are solid is going to take us a long way, no reason to overwork one of them this early in the season.
For the record, I still don't know what the point of "naming the number one starter" is, except to make life easier for fantasy hockey GMs, TV commentators, and bookies.
I have to agree with you guys. I'm beginning to see the goalie position in the NHL turn into the RB situation in the NHL. It is getting harder and harder to lean on one guy throughout the season because of how the game is played. Last season, the Bruins were splitting starts before ManFran was hurt. I don't see how the Bruins can write Thomas off, but like you said Sarah, it seems the team in more comfortable when Tuukka is between the pipes. It is too early to name the starter, but I wouldn't be surprised if Rask begins to get an extra start during the week.
Chris C: Basically for Claude when you have two great goalies like the Bruins have this season, picking one or the other each game is the hardest easiest coaching decision ever. Any other coach would die to have to make a pick between these two any day.
Agree with Sarah on the team being looser in front of Tuukka but find it weird that they play that way for Rask but allow more shots when they play in front of Thomas.
The other thing about Thomas' losses is that a lot of the blame which is being laid on him is misdirected - a lot of those losses could have been avoided had the team played the way we've seen them play in front of Tuukka. Tuukka's been the beneficiary of some nice offence on the Bruins' part.
Yes, exactly. More shots allowed on Thomas means a higher chance they'll go IN, regardless of who's in net, and that's a failure on the defense’s part.
You would think though that playing more confident up front would create more chances on your goalie, but it hasn't
I also feel that blaming Thomas is the "cool" thing to do. A lot of fans, self-included, automatically go to the "Ah Thomas sucks" saying after a Bruins loss where he starts. Seems like it's becoming a Manny Being Manny type phrase.
Which Manny? Because I think the B's went through that phase last year, too....
The REAL Manny, Mr. Ramirez!
Thomas hating is definitely the "cool thing" among fans. Thomas allows a goal and he sucks... Tuukka lets up the same one and Chara (insert any other player name here) is playing like crap tonight.
Yeah, after Manny won 7 in a row and had numbers on par with Lundqvist he fucks his back up and tries to play through it....then he sucked.
And that was the cool thing to do at the time, hate on Manny. How about the two games against the Leafs? Tuukka let in 2 goals in each of those games - what happens if the offence doesn't produce in games like that?
How is that any different than Thomas losing 2-1?
EXACTLY!
The thing I think people don't like about Thomas is his non-traditional style
It's frustrating that people don't consider the big picture when comparing the two goalies.
There isn't a difference, but Tuukka is "the new thing" in town that is fundamentally sound and has huge upside, while many people are scared of Thomas' style of play. We can all agree that sometimes Thomas looks like a fish out of water, and I think that freaks some fans out.
Yeah, I have to say, watching Tuukka is a lot less heart-attack-inducing than Timmy, except when Tuukka ends up on his back...which happens more often than I'd like to see. He's fundamentally sound....mostly, but he's young, and the errors ARE there.
Look at last night, Bruins held the lead through two then came on the ice for the 3rd and looked like dog shit and ended up losing 3-1. Yet most fans blamed Thomas. Even in the stands I heard "no more soft goal" chants going on? Why is Timmy to blame for the rest of the teams shortcomings?
To be fair, that second goal did look pretty bad from inside the arena, then again, scoring one goal in a league where a 2 GAA is really good is not a way to win games.
One more thing: Thomas has had 6 games where he's allowed 0 or 1 goals, and has only won half of those.
Agreed
Switching gears here, earlier Chris mentioned that Julien has a tough decision about which goalie to start. It's been pretty well documented that the Bruins have lacked a power play and an offense for the better part of the season. Do you think it's time that people start calling Julien out for the play of his team?
Chris, how about you kick this off
So I brought this up but many people say how can you criticize Claude... he was by far the best coach in hockey last season and nothing has really changed since last season. And I agree with you there. I mean the Bruins are still doing very well in the standing this despite the injuries and shortcomings of under performing players and we still have little over more than half a season of hockey to play. So its far to say calling out Julien is going overboard. But still Julien has done nothing to fix the lack of PP production and even offensive production at that. How about some creative line changes and working on some new plays rather than the same old tired triangle in front of the net with the man up. I know Julien is a defensive mastermind but I think its about time for someone to speak up on his lack of jumping starting a struggling offense.
Greg E: Sarah, thoughts?
Have to agree with you there - the creative line changes last year were part of why we were as successful as we were. Why haven't any of the D-pairings been mixed up, or the lines, with the exception of moving Bitz to the first line....which wasn't too successful? We saw him stay there until his recent injury. I'm not sure why Claude is doing what he's doing - I wouldn't go so far as to "call him out," but I definitely am questioning his tactics this year.
Cornelius
The bruins play a transition game for the most part - everyone gets back on D but then they try to break out quickly. I see a lot of those breakouts get stopped/intercepted/etc. Of course when they do get in they don't score most of the time unless they're playing a bottom team like the leafs or canes or whoever else.
They seem to be scoring in bunches but the current lines aren't giving them any consistency from where I'm watching
The number of times Wheeler, Krejci or Ryder has completely MISSED a pass on a breakout makes my head hurt.
Then again "consistent" for a line pretty much means "consistently scoring" for most fans.
They're not the only ones missing those passes either.
How about the whole Wideman thing, little similiar to the Tuukka/Thomas issue. You have a rookie (Boychuk) who is playing great while the veteran (Wideman) is struggling so is it fair to sit the rookie just because he is taking a vet's spot. Or is it unfair to write the vet off so quick? These are the tough decisions that Claude needs to be making but isn't.
Well, just using them as examples, Cornelius.
The bruins will get a two-on-one and then not connect on a perfect pass
Exactly. It's not anyone in particular so much as it's EVERYONE.
As far as Wideman goes, does anyone else sort of feel like he's being scapegoated?
Chris, the Wideman decision has been made for Claude and now Boychuk has a chance to play himself into a regular roster spot
Oh absolutely Wideman has become the Bruins scapegoat.
Yeah, Boychuk's great, but it's not like Hunwick's been superb this year.
Thomas, Ference, Wideman are the scapegoats on the team for sure.
No one ever talks about how Stuart busts his ass, or DMo's (Derek Morris) been solid.
I think when it comes to Wideman/Boychuk thing, people are starting to single out Wideman's play which has improved, although not dramatically, since the beginning of the season.
Not really, Wideman will make a great play here or there but for the amount of time he logs he should be. But most of the time he seems out of place, lost and just flat footed.
Hunwick has been virtually invisible all season.
Invisible isn't terrible for a defenseman. Wideman will make a great play and on the same shift fall off his skates, and people remember the falling over way more than the good defensive play.
He really has - I'm glad Claude finally sat him for Johnny B. Well, invisible as far as not solid offensively or defensively. He hasn't thrown his body around the way Stuart does, or played as solidly as he did last year. I'm actually interested to see how he does as a forward, to be honest.
Agreed. Just because his (Hunwick) point production is the same doesn't mean he has been playing that bad. Then you got Wideman who we come to expect a certain type of play from and he is not giving us that at all. Remember we still don’t have too much data on Hunwick, one good year isn’t enough to judge a player on.
True - I guess looking at his NCAA and AHL numbers don't really stack up to what he can/can't do in the NHL.
But getting off Wides (no homo) I want to look at the need to switch up some of the offensive lines and maybe creating some new looks on the PP.
True. Sometimes no news for a defenseman is good news.
ie Sarah... Brad Marchand, he didn’t really carry over to the NHL to well.
Exactly, it's just an entirely different level of play. I think Marchand's also just really young - he'll get there eventually.
True but in the league run by young stars and players I kind of think the "too young excuse" is getting too old (look at that pun on the fly).
Terrible. Okay, let me amend - maybe not developed enough. I'd honestly like to see Brad spend another year in the A, see if he can make any further improvements, and give him another shot.
Do you think changing the lines will improve the offense and/or power play or is it time for Julien and his staff to implement some new strategy into their game?
I think the Bruins need a mix of both Greg, some new strategy needs to come with new lineups when you look at it. Maybe try pairing some players together that may have struggled in the past. I would love to see a Sobotka-Bergeron-Wheeler line or Wheeler-Krejci-Ryder line give it a go.
As for changing strategy, the sharks last year dominated the league to start the season but then the coach apparently complicated the game plan too much, and then we all watched as the ducks stomped them out in the first round.
Marchand will be good over time but he obviously needs to perfect his game which I see mirroring Lucic over time.
Sobotka-Bergeron-Wheeler....
That is definitely something new and different.
That's a very interesting line for sure.
Outside the box over here!
They go from smallest and most physical to largest and least.
Right? Sobotka astounds me.
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The second part of the discussion will be posted tomorrow. We had a great time last night and it's great to find out what the opinions of other bloggers.
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